From: john smith on 29 Apr 2010 23:12
Hey John K. Sorry I brought this up but does just the utterance of the
name Dunn drive you into a frenzy?
From: tom dunne on 29 Apr 2010 23:23
On Apr 29, 11:06 pm, John Kasupski <w2...(a)spamfilter.verizon.net>
> On Thu, 29 Apr 2010 17:36:40 -0700 (PDT), tom dunne <dunn...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> >Player A: .249 avg/.383 obp/.518 slg, 40 homers, 97 RBI, career 132 OPS
> >+, lead league in strikeouts 3 times.
> >Player B: .262 avg/.356 obp/.490 slg, 32 homers, 98 RBI, career 139 OPS
> >+, lead league in strikeouts 5 times.
> >Which one is a Hall of Famer with 4 rings, and which one is the reason
> >why his franchises are perennial losers? How can you tell the
> >difference? Honest answers only, please - no looking up the names
> >until after you submit your guess!
> David, I don't need to look those up to figure out that Dunn is Player A (for
> one thing I just mentioned his career .249 average upthread) and to guess that
> Reggie Jackson is Player B. See what happens when you only look at part of the
> picture? Jackson earned the name "Mr. October" - and wound up in the Hall - in
> part because he performed even better in postseason play - hitting exclusively
> against pitching staffs that were good enough for their teams to make the
> playoffs - than he did during regular season play:
> Stat -- Regular Season -- Postseason
> BA -- .262 -- .278
> SLG -- .490 -- .527
> OPS -- .846 -- .885
> Dunn will never be a Mr. October. He doesn't get that far, he vanishes in
> September and drags his team down with him. He's no Reggie Jackson. He's Dave
> Kingman (yeah, I know, but...) - who unlike Dunn actually played in the NLDS
> once, in 1971 when he was a rookie...hit .111 with 3 Ks in 9 at-bats, his team
> lost, and he played another 15 years in the majors without ever sniffing
> postseason play again.
> Like Dunn, he was a butcher defensively (his career fielding percentage is below
> league average at all four positions that he played - 1B, 3B, LF, RF), and like
> Dunn, his trade value was minimal (unless you consider getting traded for the
> likes of Paul Siebert, Bobby Valentine, Randy Stein, and Steve Henderson to
> indicate that he was highly coveted by opposing teams and that the GMs of the
> teams he played for were just stupid...which may indeed be the case considering
> that they signed him or traded for him in the first place).
> Like Dunn, you could forget getting veteran leadership out of the guy - Dunn's
> idea of veteran leadership was to join Ken Griffey Jr. in putting two Sharper
> Image massage chairs in the clubhouse and then manager Dave Miley had them
> removed, hanging Danny Graves' jersey near his locker as an homage to his
> departed friend and whining to the press, "So now we're going to start winning,
> it was the chair's fault." Kingman's idea of veteran leadership was to get fined
> $3500 for sending a rat to a female reporter to protest female reporters being
> in the clubhouse.
> They'd have probably made great teammates on the modern Washington Nationals,
> the Cubs of the late 70's, or the Oakland Athletics of '84-'86 - all of which
> share a considerable distance between themselves and postseason play.
> What exactly do you think Ricciardi was talking about up in Toronto in '08 when
> he ripped Dunn on the radio? Do you really think it's a coincidence that the
> only team willing to sign him to a free agent contract was the absolute worst
> team in baseball, the same team who happily welcomed Wily Taveras into the fold
> this year after his monumental flop in Cinci last year (and this time
> Leatherpants had nothing to do with it) and traded promising outfield prospect
> Chris Carter to the BoSox the for Wily Mo after he flopped in both Cinci AND
> Boston? Do you really think Walt Jocketty, who assembled teams in St. Louis that
> won seven division titles, a wild card, two NL pennants and a WS, suddenly
> turned stupid when he came to Cinci, or do you think maybe he knows what he's
> doing and had a good reason for getting rid of Dunn as soon as he got a
> chance...including some things that possibly don't show up in a box score?
> The fact that the Reds haven't replaced his numbers yet is irrelevant. The
> inability to afford a prosthesis to replace a gangrenous leg that is amputated
> in order to save the life of the patient is not a logical reason for the patient
> to keep the leg and die of necrosis.
> Now please, let's put this argument back to bed where it belongs and get on with
> the business of enjoying the current season instead of arguing about something
> that's over and done with and has been for three years now.
You mention a lot of other stuff about Dunn in this post. I really
wasn't referring to any of that. I'm just saying that having high
strikeout guys in the middle of your order doesn't mean much,
especially if they're also high OPS guys.
Also, I'm not David :)
From: tom dunne on 29 Apr 2010 23:26
On Apr 29, 11:08 pm, John Kasupski <w2...(a)spamfilter.verizon.net>
> On Fri, 30 Apr 2010 03:06:43 +0000, John Kasupski <w2...(a)spamfilter.verizon.net>
> >David, I don't need to look those up to figure out...
> And I did that twice, too. Since I was replying to Tom and not to David, that's
> a little embarassing. Sorry, my bad!
Haha - you posted while I was typing my other reply. No worries,
David and I say the same stuff a lot of the time :D
From: HTP on 29 Apr 2010 23:41
On Apr 29, 7:38 pm, tom dunne <dunn...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> On Apr 29, 9:59 pm, eddyg...(a)msn.com (john smith) wrote:
> > guess Adam Dunn and Reggie Jackson?
> You got it in one, John! Their career averages are very similar, and
> Reggie Jackson is actually the all-time strikeout leader in MLB
> history. He also made the playoffs 11 times, with three different
> franchises. Jackson shares the all-time strikeout top ten with Willie
> Stargell, Mike Schmidt and Tony Perez, each one a Hall of Famer and
> champion. Strikeouts are no fun to watch, but they really just don't
> mean anything about how good or bad a player is.
Not to nitpick, but Jackson played on 5 world series winners.
and yes, i knew it was dunn and jackson
From: HTP on 29 Apr 2010 23:42
On Apr 29, 8:12 pm, eddyg...(a)msn.com (john smith) wrote:
> Hey John K. Sorry I brought this up but does just the utterance of the
> name Dunn drive you into a frenzy?