Get rid of Manual, Beltran, Castillo, Perez, and Maine - Steinbrenner would have done that long ago!
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From: Stewart on 24 Jul 2010 12:27 "montygraham" <monty1945(a)lycos.com> wrote in message news:b58c4dcf-9290-4e32-8344-7fa4e669b0a2(a)k39g2000yqb.googlegroups.com... > Sorry, but I want the guys who don't come through in the clutch to > be > gone, The game is built on failure. Even those that seem to come through in the "clutch" will fail much more than they ever succeed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clutch_hitter > and Beltran has done that enough in his career to be an > "untouchable" on this team. Reyes and Wright are the big > disappointments. Bay is an enigma and should be benched in favor of > determining if any of the young players are any good, and Francoeur > should be traded for anything, or just released. It's time to tell > the players that they need to actually produce. Jerry seems > incapable > of doing that, so he's got to go, but I have confidence he'll be > gone > at the season's end. My question is how many more years are we > going > to witness Reyes and Wright not coming through in the clutch, > sitting > out long periods of time with "injuries" (Reyes), looking lost, > confused, or clueless, and throwing balls away on easy plays > (Wright)?
From: Stewart on 24 Jul 2010 12:44 "montygraham" <monty1945(a)lycos.com> wrote in message news:6bbdd55e-ee02-4c5e-a202-2bd58a14642b(a)g35g2000yqa.googlegroups.com... > It's not about being slightly above or below the league average. If > you get rid of Beltran and keep Wright and Reyes, then what happens > when it comes time to produce when the team needs a win to get into > the playoffs? I watched a historic collapse a few years back and a > terrible collapse right after that one. And you can go back and > watch > the video of those games to see what Wright, Reyes, and Beltran did > (as well as what Beltran did with Houston in the playoffs). If you > want to play some sort of "fantasy" baseball with statistics, that's > fine, but it's not even getting the Mets into the playoffs, is it? If you have players that do well statistically, you will have a much higher probability to reach the playoffs then you would if your team was loaded with intangibles. > Now let me make this clear: if this team wants to be taken > seriously, > there needs to be guys who have "been there and done that" on it. > Beltran has, whereas Wright and Reyes have not. Where has Beltran been that he has done anything except be a pretty good player? David Wright's career OPS is 50 points higher then Beltran's and his career average for 162 games is almost identical for HR/RBI, and he is just hitting his prime years while even a healthy Beltran is on the decline. If anything, dump Beltran and keep Wright. Reyes, well...he's better than some, and he's young as well. His career OBP isn't great, but he has gotten it up over .350 the past few years until this year (down to .318) as his BB numbers are lower. > I have no problem > keeping them on the team, but then a bunch of guys need go, and they > need to be replaced with guys like Beltran. Is that going to > happen? Again, what has Beltran done that makes him better than say, Wright? > No, so the other idea is to see what some of the young players can > do, > rather than having guys like Francoeur trot out there ever again. > Then, in a few years, Wright and Reyes may have matured and you've > figured out which young players can get the job done. In a few years (3-4) Reyes and Wright will be considered veterans not young players, and just about at the tail end of their prime years.
From: Ruben Safir on 24 Jul 2010 22:30 On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 21:45:28 -0700, montygraham wrote: > It's not about being slightly above or below the league average. If you > get rid of Beltran and keep Wright and Reyes, then what happens when it > comes time to produce when the team needs a win to get into the > playoffs? Until you admit that Wright can hit in the clutch then there is no point to reading your post. What should I do, flame you? Your a nice guy but your just WRONG. Ruben
From: Ruben Safir on 24 Jul 2010 22:37 On Sat, 24 Jul 2010 08:21:34 -0400, Uncle Abogado® wrote: > On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 21:45:28 -0700 (PDT), montygraham > <monty1945(a)lycos.com> wrote: > >>It's not about being slightly above or below the league average. > > No one said it was. The problem is that you're referencing stuff that > simply isn't happening. Reyes isn't faking injuries, and Wright isn't > making tons of throwing errors at third. You're simply spouting off > your own prejudices here with no regard for the facts. > >>If you get rid of Beltran > > Where did I ever suggest getting rid of Beltran? > >>and keep Wright and Reyes, then what happens when it comes time to >>produce when the team needs a win to get into the playoffs? > > If the rest of the team is good enough, then the same thing should > happen that happened in 2006: they'll get in. > >>I watched a historic collapse a few years back and a terrible collapse >>right after that one. > > Yes, so did I, and so did everyone else here. But to blame those > collapses on Reyes and, in particular, David Wright, who hit > .352/.432/.604 in September 2007 and .340/.416/.577 in September 2008, > is ridiculous. For what it's worth, Beltran hit .282/.328/.555 and > .344/.440/.645 during those same two Septembers. Good, but overall > not better than Wright. > >>And you can go back and watch >>the video of those games to see what Wright, Reyes, and Beltran did (as >>well as what Beltran did with Houston in the playoffs). > > Maybe you need to watch those videos yourself, and pay particularly > close attention to the performance of the Mets bullpen, which blew lead > after lead down the stretch in 2008. And maybe you also need to go > back and watch the last at-bat of the 2006 NLCS, which ended with Carlos > Beltran standing at the plate with his bat still on his shoulder. > >>If you want to play some sort of "fantasy" baseball with statistics, >>that's fine, but it's not even getting the Mets into the playoffs, is >>it? > > Oh sorry, I keep forgetting that statistics don't matter, except to > nerds and fantasy baseball geeks. After all, why rely upon the actual > record of events that transpired on the field when we have your own > infallible memory, right? > >>Now let me make this clear: if this team wants to be taken seriously, >>there needs to be guys who have "been there and done that" on it. >>Beltran has, whereas Wright and Reyes have not. > > Been where and done what, exactly? He's sure as hell never been to a > World Series, if that's what you mean. You're going on and on about > Beltran's 2004 postseason as if it were proof of something, but the > bottom line is that it was 12 good games, 12 games that happened six > years ago. Those two series mean absolutely nothing now, and they > certainly don't define his Met career relative to that of Reyes or > Wright. Here's what matters to me, and to most Mets fans: since his > arrival in New York, Beltran has made exactly one appearance in the > postseason in 2006, where he was lousy against the Dodgers, and against > the Cardinals -- well, we all now what happened there. And the bottom > line is that all three players have the same number of championship > rings: zero. You're just making arbitrary distinctions between a > player you seem to like and two players you want to blame for all the > team's problems. It's wrong factually, and unfair to boot. > >>keeping them on the team, but then a bunch of guys need go, and they >>need to be replaced with guys like Beltran. > > Sorry, but the last thing any team needs is an entire roster of Carlos > Beltrans, unless they're hell-bent on collecting a group of sullen, > oft-injured and unreliable players. Beltran is a tremendous talent, > and my preference would be for him to remain a Met, but all the physical > talent in the world doesn't necessarily excuse the way that he defied > Met management during the offseason, a decision that unquestionably hurt > the team this season. What's more, he's never struck me as a guy > who's committed himself 100% to this organization, certainly not the way > that both Wright and Reyes have, and it looks to me like he's already > got one foot out the door after 2011. For all of his considerable > ability, Beltran has always looked and acted the part of a high-priced > mercenary -- not that there's anything truly wrong with that, but I > don't think any team really needs 25 of them. I don't agree with that. I don't blame Beltran for 2006 or the decision this off season. The medical reports are pretty clear on this. If Beltran didn't take care of his illness, that this is what the reports say, that it is a form of congenital arthitis, then he'd be useless over the next 3 season. This situation was squarely the Wilpon's fault. And should we just ignor what Beltran did in Houton? And how he's played for the Mets? Neither Beltran, Wright or Reyes is at fault for their recent past or their current situation. Did Beltran not return to play his best ever baseball after nearly a life threatening injury when he collided with Cameron? Come on guys. Ruben
From: Ruben Safir on 24 Jul 2010 22:39
On Sat, 24 Jul 2010 08:21:34 -0400, Uncle Abogado® wrote: > For > all of his considerable ability, Beltran has always looked and acted the > part of a high-priced mercenary -- not that there's anything truly wrong > with that, but I don't think any team really needs 25 of them. If that is the case he was one hell of a mercenary. He put together 3 seasons of some the best for a CF EVER in that time. He's earned ever single dime he has made. Ruben |